Starting/Running Issue

[JonnyHen]

hi, all, was wondering if anyone could give me some tips on diagnosing a starting/running issue with my 92. kind of new to wcvw's (always had ac). Here goes...

A couple days ago my 92 cabby cut out on me on the highway with no warning whatsoever. Cruising aroun 55 or so, engine just dies, no sputtering, choking etc. car now will not start havent had a chance to get under the hood yet, but wondering if anyone else has experienced an issue like this and where to start looking to diagnose this problem. car cranks like mad, just wont start. someone stole my gas cap the day before, not sure if this would have anything to do with this problem or not. has been very cold here the last few days, but relatively dry. have not had chance to check compression as the car is sitting in a parking lot and havent had a chance to get my tools there yet. car died like it was electrical. have power everywhere else. any help would be appreciated. i am also posting this on other forums, so apologize if you see this elsewhere, just in a real bind as this is my daily/only car right now. thanks in advance!

[Briano1234]

If you turn the Key on do you hear the fuel pump prime?
yes, then check the fuel pressures at the injector rail.

When you were driving did you hear a loud or medium loud whine from the rear wheel arch passenger side, you can hear it from the inside.

Have you verified that there is spark to the spark plugs?

With the hood raised and shrouded, that is covered so that it is dark, have some one turn the car over while you look at the spark plugs and wires and cap for sparking fairies. If you see any then you can scrape the track off with a pocket knife or sand paper.

[JonnyHen]

no whine from anywhere, havent had a chance to check plugs yet, died at night, and havent had a chance to get back with tools. was just coming back to this to post more info after reading another thread. the last couple weeks the car has gotten sluggish after driving it for about 30 miles or so, as soon as i turn it off and start it again, no problems, fuel pump possibly? the only thing that really confused me was that there was no choking at all this time, engine just stopped running

[Briano1234]

no whine from anywhere, havent had a chance to check plugs yet, died at night, and havent had a chance to get back with tools. was just coming back to this to post more info after reading another thread. the last couple weeks the car has gotten sluggish after driving it for about 30 miles or so, as soon as i turn it off and start it again, no problems, fuel pump possibly? the only thing that really confused me was that there was no choking at all this time, engine just stopped running

Just died indicates a electrical or fuel issue. You didn't say if you hear the fuel pumps prime when you tun the key to run (not start) the fuel pumps must run for about 4 seconds prior to start. If you don't hear them prime then suspect the fuel pump relay, as a test you can swap the horn relay for the fuel pump relay.

Cabby-info.com electrical then look for the fuse panel diagrams. Is this a Automatic, or standard transmission?

Did you see the sparking fairies that I mentioned.

[JonnyHen]

i honestly have no idea what to even listen for when the fuel pumps prime. all the cars ive worked on in the past have had mech. fuel pumps (aircoolds).
not sure if this has anything to do with the issue either, but about ten minutes before it cut out, i put air in the right rear tire. 100 yards up the road, heard a "pssssht" sound from what sounded like the same part of the car, but had no loss in tire pressure after the car died...just remembered that. been a rough couple days without a car and a 45 mile one way commute to work so im a little frazzled

[JonnyHen]

havent checked plugs, havent been able to get back to car with tools. been borrowing vehicles for a few days, but hope will check it out tonight

[Briano1234]

Could of been a fuel pump died there are 2 of them.
With the Stereo off, the heater off, put the key in the ignition and turn it to the run (not the start) position that is the first click.
You should hear a 4 second sound of humming or a burrrrr noise from the rear of the car. If not, then you need to look in to swapping the fuel pump relay out with the horn relay as a test.

The in-tank pump is 50 bucks, the main pump is 250.
Ron, Tolusina has a write up on replacing both pumps with 1 pump, and getting rid of a bunch of stuff..
I have done the 2 for one swap, and it is easy on the pocket, less than 80 bucks.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.p ... hlight=Big

[JonnyHen]

ok i'll look into that. it does hum when i turn it to "on". i'll check spark first tonight, then get it home and up in the air to attack the fuel pumps. thanks for the info! im kink of illiterate when it comes to these watercoolds. i'll try the relay swap as well while im there. thanks again!

[Briano1234]

If it hums then do a fuel pressure test as that is a indication that it isn't the fuel pumps and that they are priming.
fuel pumps Primary front of rear axle passenger side, one internal to the tank (called the transfer pump).

Have you replaced the main grounds battery to frame and frame to the Tranny? They go bad, and replacing them is cheap and effective insurance.
I would look for sparking fairies as if you drove over slushy water you could of sprayed the engine.

Also I have seen the blue cts sensor cause a no start cold/warm, and crappy running.
you can unplug it ans see if it runs better. Lastly, I have has a o2 sensor act up and cause a no start, You can unplug it too and see if it runs, as if it is broke the wrong way it can cause a too lean, and the car won't start.

CTS is on the grille side of the engine water outlet flange on the head (do not try to remove it, as on a cold plastic part you may crack the outlet flange).

o2 sensor connector is on the driver side of the valve cover at the rear there is a bracket that holds the connector. If the o2 is the issue then a cheap generic can be substituted but you will have to solder it in.
The BOSCH number is 13913 or 19342 will work.

[kamzcab86]

Twice I had the timing belt go bad on me while driving: once it broke, the next it jumped a tooth. In both cases, it would sit there and crank but not start. Pull the cover off and check the belt... easy thing to do for quick problem elimination, or discovery.

[CalAltaDubber]

This did happen to me once. Unfortunatly, I did not resolve the issue, the car was my Evil Rabbit, a 1980 Rabbit GTI that was very badly abused before I bought it. Since the car was so badly rusted out, I didn't want to spend more than it was worth to fix it.

I was sure in that case the fault was electrical, There was fuel all the way to the injectors. When I think back on it now, I think it had to be GROUNDS. Since the carw was held togrther by rust it only makes sense to me now. I guess it's time for Brians rant on good grounds.

[Briano1234]

Twice I had the timing belt go bad on me while driving: once it broke, the next it jumped a tooth. In both cases, it would sit there and crank but not start. Pull the cover off and check the belt... easy thing to do for quick problem elimination, or discovery.

Dam and I had that happen to me...
If it is broke or skipped be thankful on the gassers it don't usually hurt nothing.

[JonnyHen]

update: got bridget running last night, wound up being a bad distributor cap and rotor. car actually runs the best it has since ive owned it.
timing belt is the next thing going to be done to the car, pulled the cover last night and its still got some life left in it, but i dont know a whole lot about the service history of the car so i figure i'll be better safe than sorry and do it. probably going to do the fuel pumps as well.
i guess i cant really complain about the things ive had to replace on this car since it was free, and in total i still have less than $100 in to it